Aero Vintage B-17 and B-25 News Update

aerovin · **Posted:** Thu Dec 29, 2011 10:06 pm

B-17 News with a bunch of stuff: http://www.aerovintage.com/b17news.htm

B-25 News-not so much stuff but an update on the Mandatory Service Bulletin for the B-25 landing gear:http://www.aerovintage.com/b25news.htm

mustangdriver · **Posted:** Thu Dec 29, 2011 10:53 pm

Great update

TAdan · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 10:11 am

Thanks for the updates, I always look forward to them.

Pat Carry · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 11:29 am

Lots of great info Scott. The situation with the Tulare B-17 and the B-17 at the USAF Armament Museum is kind of sad. Eventually these 2 planes will just rot away to nothing. Nice to see something might be happening with the B-17 in Oregon however. How about that dig in England! An amazing find for sure. I wonder if the same can be found underground at all the former 8th AF bases.

Pat Carry · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 11:52 am

Does anyone know how the other B-17's on outdoor display are holding up? Chris, I know your team is doing a fine job with the one at Grissom but how about the ones located at Dyess, Lackland, Castle, March and Offut. Are they suffering the ravages of mother nature as well?

StangStung · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 11:53 am

Thansk for posting, I always enjoy reading these.

cooper9411 · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 11:57 am

It's always great to hear about another precious piece of our history being saved, what sucks is that some of the groups or organizations only save them for the publicity and after saving the aircraft can't afford or don't have the foresight to preserve them.

res6kgcr · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 12:41 pm

Hi Scott,

The tail code is Mike-Sugar-Fiver which Mike is the III Bomber Command code letter for McDill, Sugar the plane letter and Fiver the squadron designator (the squadrons in a Base Unit are lettered not number hence the number). Freeman & Osborne list 42-4370 as reported at McDill 26 Sept 1943 and then at RFC Bozeman 13 Oct 1945 which is a long time at one station for a state side trainer.

What is an enigma is the P-51 sans any field number or letters just the diagonal stripe. Can you make out the tail number?

Hope that is a help.

Tom

mustangdriver · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 2:51 pm

I am sure that on some level that the ones outside are suffereing some damage at one level or another. The only answer is to get them inside. I know that is not an easy answer for any group restoring a B-17, but it is the only way. I know for a fact that the NMUSAF is working to stream line some of these collections that just can't keep up with the aircraft. I look for some B-17's to get moved in this process. If you want my honest opinion the ones that you are likely to see moved are:

Dyess AFB
Eglin AFB
Grissom AFB

This is unless these museums are able to get a building to place them in. I saw the ones at March AFB, and Castle this summer. They both look pretty good. The March one is in the process of a complete repaint. The Offut one is a rare F model. I have heard that it is in nice shape, but a shell. I have talked with the base, and they are willing to escort me on for a visit, so I will try and get some photos.

Pat Carry · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 3:12 pm

mustangdriver wrote:

I am sure that on some level that the ones outside are suffereing some damage at one level or another. The only answer is to get them inside. I know that is not an easy answer for any group restoring a B-17, but it is the only way. I know for a fact that the NMUSAF is working to stream line some of these collections that just can't keep up with the aircraft. I look for some B-17's to get moved in this process. If you want my honest opinion the ones that you are likely to see moved are:

Dyess AFB
Eglin AFB
Grissom AFB

This is unless these museums are able to get a building to place them in. I saw the ones at March AFB, and Castle this summer. They both look pretty good. The March one is in the process of a complete repaint. The Offut one is a rare F model. I have heard that it is in nice shape, but a shell. I have talked with the base, and they are willing to escort me on for a visit, so I will try and get some photos.

Chris, I hope the one at Tulare gets moved also. That one seems to be in the worst shape from what I see here on the WIX, from what is on Scott's aerovintage site and of course what's in the bible of survivng B-17's, Scott's "Final Cut" book.

cooper9411 · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 3:15 pm

I think we all share that same sentiment.

mustangdriver · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 3:16 pm

Well the issue with the one at Tulare is ownership. I guess there is some dispute if the NMUSAF owns the aircraft. Also to be very honest, the one at Tulare is in better shape than the one at Grissom. We really have a huge battle ahead if the Grissom aircraft is going to stay where she is.

cooper9411 · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 3:18 pm

mustangdriver wrote:

Well the issue with the one at Tulare is ownership. I guess there is some dispute if the NMUSAF owns the aircraft. Also to be very honest, the one at Tulare is in better shape than the one at Grissom. We really have a huge battle ahead if the Grissom aircraft is going to stay where she is.

First I've heard of it belonging to NMUSAF

Pat Carry · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 3:44 pm

mustangdriver wrote:

Well the issue with the one at Tulare is ownership. I guess there is some dispute if the NMUSAF owns the aircraft. Also to be very honest, the one at Tulare is in better shape than the one at Grissom. We really have a huge battle ahead if the Grissom aircraft is going to stay where she is.

Wow Chris, After seeing a photo of the interior of the one Tulare in Scott's update, then the one at Grissom must be real bad. Is the issue mostly corrosion or just a general decay and neglect in the fuselage over the years?

mustangdriver · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 4:35 pm

Well the Grissom aircraft has been outdoors in Indiana weather since the 1950's. It was placed in a tail high attitude to simulate flight. During this time water was trapped in the belly of the aircraft. Also the insulation in the cockpit and nose held in moisture as well. The Corrosion in these areas is extreme. One of the main gussets in the bombay area has corroded off of the aircraft all together. Over the years the aircraft also gave up many parts to various restorations. She needs alot of work, but that is only part of the problem. the other part is getting it under a roof for restoration and display.

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