This is the place where the majority of the warbird (aircraft that have survived military service) discussions will take place. Specialized forums may be added in the new future
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Mon Oct 24, 2005 8:38 am

Like any business, it depends on who is running the store and how well its done........

Cheers,

Lynn

Mon Oct 24, 2005 8:49 am

spookyboss wrote:If you own a B-17 it can make money enough to pay for itself, several years ago the EAA brought there B-17 here and in talking to the crew found out they make over $800,000 a year with it. It's hard to believe they can't fly Fuddy Duddy and make money enough to support the museum.


The problem with that equation is that you have to probably spend nearly $2M to conduct the tour in the first place, train and maintain a pool of viable pilots and volunteers, and have a large enough parts and maintenance pool to keep the planes running... and on top of that, you need a press agent (or three) to get the word out in the areas you tour to. I know EAA does because they have the cash flow... AND they have plenty of local volunteers with EAA chapters being the hosts at each place. Does NWM have chapters? Nope. Does NWM have a nationwide presence? Nope. Does NWM have the cash flow, parts, or pilot pool outside of the EAA assistance? Nope. A barnstorming tour isn't an immediate solution to a long term problem that mainly involves the museum not being able to support the high overhead involved in maintaining a physical museum.

Ryan Keough

Mon Oct 24, 2005 9:19 pm

If you're the buyer of Fuddy Duddy, do you keep it in it's colors, or do you choose another paint scheme?

Personally, if I hit the next $300 million Powerball jackpot and could afford Fuddy Duddy, besides doing top notch authentic restoration, I'd have her painted as "I'll Be Around" from the 95th BG, the lead plane on the first 8th AF misison to Berlin on March 4, 1944.

Tue Oct 25, 2005 8:34 pm

Col. Rohr wrote:... it was a few folks did'nt like how Jeff pulled out of NWH.


Clarify? I have no idea what this means... Jeff wasn't part of National Warplane Museum originally if that is what you were implying.

Ryan

Tue Nov 01, 2005 8:38 am

Found some more information:

BIG FLATS - The Wings of Eagles Discovery Center is searching for more cash to keep its centerpiece attraction in the sky.

The museum has contracted with Courtesy Aircraft Sales, a Rockford, Ill.-based broker of warplanes and other aircraft, to find a sponsor for the storied B-17 bomber Fuddy Duddy - or a buyer.

It's the second time the museum has considered selling its most prized possession. The first was when the facility, then known as the National Warplane Museum, was fighting for its survival.

Now, museum officials are shopping Fuddy Duddy around because the cost of flying a World War II-vintage warbird is becoming prohibitive.

"Unfortunately, over the years the economics of the B-17 have changed significantly, starting with the $100,000 to insure the airplane before you even turn a prop," said Wings of Eagles Executive Director Mike Hall.

"The airplane burns a couple hundred gallons of fuel an hour. In some places, aviation fuel is over $6 a gallon. So without significant sponsorship, operating it ourselves is not something we can do."

Ideally, the museum will find a corporate sponsor or sponsors that will underwrite some or all of the B-17's operating expenses so the museum can make it available to people who might not otherwise be able to afford to fly in it, Hall said.

If a sponsorship deal can't be worked out, selling the craft is a possibility, he said.

Right now, Hall said, the people who can afford the $400 to ride in Fuddy Duddy are older people who already have an interest in vintage warbirds.

"Much less of the market is the next generation. So we're trying to create a situation where we might be able to serve that market educationally," he said.

"That market can't reach into their pocket and pay for the experience. A corporate name would accompany the experience. But we would also have the opportunity to put youth, in particular, on the airplane and bridge that gap over several generations."

Wings of Eagles still has a cooperative agreement with the Experimental Aircraft Association, which leases Fuddy Duddy and tours the country with it, Hall said. That arrangement is a break-even deal at best, he said.

The museum contacted Courtesy Aircraft Sales earlier this month. The "flying fortress" is now featured at the top of the company's Web page.

Courtesy Aircraft Sales was founded in 1958 as a Cessna aircraft dealer and has since expanded to include several other dealerships. The business added warbirds in the early 1970s.

The company deals with museums and collectors around the world, and prospects are good that a deal to help keep Fuddy Duddy flying can be brokered, said Courtesy Aircraft Sales President Mark Clark.

"They contracted with us to look at various options. Finding a national sponsor is one; finding someone to buy it and donate it back, or sell the airplane, are the others," Clark said. "It just depends on which one is the most viable option for the museum.

"The thrust is to have the airplane continue to tell its historical story and its inspirational story," he said. "A lot of museums have an interest in the airplane.

"It's a fantastic resource. These airplanes have touched everybody."


I found it here

http://www.star-gazette.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051101/NEWS01/511010301/1001

Wed Nov 30, 2005 12:39 pm

I heard that there is a possible buyer for Fuddy Duddy. Anyone at liberty to expound on this?

Thu Dec 01, 2005 8:17 pm

TimApNy wrote:I heard that there is a possible buyer for Fuddy Duddy. Anyone at liberty to expound on this?


The latest issue of Air Classics hinted at this...perhaps this is what you're referring to (?). I hope a good buyer stepped up to get her...and will continue to keep her flying.

Tue Dec 06, 2005 9:24 pm

The 1941 Historical Aircraft Group Museum is actively trying to keep Fuddy Duddy in New York. They have been busy contacting the NY State Board Of Regents, NY State Attorney General and various state politicians. Assemblyman Dan Burling attended the November monthly meeting on Nov. 10 and spoke of the importance of keeping the Fuddy Duddy in New York, and made a personal pledge of $1,000 if HAG decides to purchase her. Austin Wadsworth also pledged $1,000. As you all know, Austin Wadsworth, Dr. Bill Anderson and Ed Hopkins selected the B-17 at the Globe Air Auction in 1986, and she was purchased by the National Warplane Museum and flown back to Geneseo in March 1986. She was then restored by volunteers under the supervision of Ed Hopkins from 1986 to 1994 at the Geneseo Airport, and as a result of the organizational split, left with the National Warplane Museum, (now The Wings Of Eagles Discovery Center) for Elmira in 1997. Apparently, "The focus and efforts of the WOEDC are changing and the B-17 does not really fit in the new model." You can check for further developments on this matter on the 1941 Historical Group Museum's Website Message Board. The website is located at http://www.1941hag.org
Fuddy Duddy, let's bring her home where she belongs.
CAVU Always,
Tom Kwiatkowski Sr.
Moderator
1941 HAG Website Message Board.
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