Sun n Fun warbird report?

[marine air]

Umm, Yak-52Tw's are not warbirds. They are recently built civilian specialty aircraft built for civilians. Don't think any of them (tailwheel) were ever used in a military. Basically they are no more warbird than a Legend Cub in green paint and stars and bars. Or a 2013 Waco YMF-5D biplane for that matter.

[Boeing666]

I was very disappointed in the warbirds this year. I went 5 days to Sun N Fun - Wed thru Sunday and was quite upset at the lack of turnout. I would have thought there would have been extra effort to bring in more warbirds (even if having to pay for their fuel and putting the pilots in a hotel like Sun N Fun used to years ago) with no military this year - other than a Navy Texan II and a replica Thunderbirds F-16 that was trucked in.

Draken pulled out one of their A-4s and two Aermachhi jets on Wednesday and took off at the end of the show and came back about 30 min later, another one of their A-4s and a Mig 21 were on display in front of their building over my the homebuilt overnight camping area

There were 2 B-25s Panchito and Yellow Rose, no killer Bee this year
2 C-47s, one an AC-47, the other a regular in olive drab as well as a South African registered turbo DC-3
Helldiver
Kermit Weeks Hellcat
Super T-6
4 Mustangs total - Red Tail, Brat III, Crazy Horse 1 and 2
OV-1
A-4C
Black Diamonds 4 L-39s, T-33 and 2 Mig-17s - the Migs are grounded and never went up
1 Corsair
silver C-45 that is here every year
5 T-28s
a civilian painted HU-16


Rest were pseudo warbirds
a ton of T-6s
a Bunch of Nanchangs
a couple T-34s
a ton of Nanchangs and Yaks
4 L-39s (besides Black Diamonds)
a handful of L birds
a couple O-2s
U-3 Aerocommander
a couple of those Cessna 310 Blue Canoes
some other foreign military planes like Bulldogs, IARs etc

Quite sad when as far as I know B-17 Chuckie is still sitting at New Smyrna Beach, there are a few other locally based P-51s, that I saw at New Smyrna Beach Airshow just a couple days before- Obsession and Lady B, a Catalina down at Tamiami etc

[Marauderman26]

"Kermit Weeks Hellcat"

Say again?

[JohnTerrell]

Should say Wildcat. ; )

[P51Mstg]

Wildcat is proper.... If it was the Hellcat it would have been trucked over...

Mark H

[Boeing666]

Wildcat is proper.... If it was the Hellcat it would have been trucked over...

Mark H

Oops I was thinking about the Helldiver at the same time and said Hellcat instead of Wildcat...

N222FM

Boeing, I agree it was not a memorable gathering of warbirds. It was the only Sun 'n Fun I have been to and while it had its interesting and enjoyable, it was a definitely a little light in warbirds which is my primary interest.

I did like the Draken flyby of the A-4 and 2 Macchi MB-339's, too bad it was done so late in the and at a time that more could not have enjoyed it.

A couple of points, though:

You did not mention one of the best warbirds at the show, the Cavanaugh AD-5/EA-1E Skyraider. Enjoyed seeing it fly on Wednesday.

Also (and I am not a big T-6 fan by a long shot), I would not call the T-6/SNJ a "pseudo-warbird." It served for many years in the Army, Air Force, Navy and Marines and earned every right to be called a "warbird." Any aircraft that actually served in Military service qualifies to be called a warbird.

[Marauderman26]

Wildcat is proper.... If it was the Hellcat it would have been trucked over...

Mark H

Oops I was thinking about the Helldiver at the same time and said Hellcat instead of Wildcat...

N222FM

OK...Kermit has a HELLDIVER? As in Curtiss SB2C.
What BuNo?
News to me.........

[Boeing666]

Wildcat is proper.... If it was the Hellcat it would have been trucked over...

Mark H

Oops I was thinking about the Helldiver at the same time and said Hellcat instead of Wildcat...

N222FM

OK...Kermit has a HELLDIVER? As in Curtiss SB2C.
What BuNo?
News to me.........

I think I still have Sun N Fun hangover, sorry if I confused you. I was thinking of the CAF Helldiver, which was there when I was typing about Kermit's Wildcat when I accidentally called his Wildcat a Hellcat

[Marauderman26]

No biggie Boeing 666, at least you got to go..envy.

[Boeing666]

Boeing, I agree it was not a memorable gathering of warbirds. It was the only Sun 'n Fun I have been to and while it had its interesting and enjoyable, it was a definitely a little light in warbirds which is my primary interest.

I did like the Draken flyby of the A-4 and 2 Macchi MB-339's, too bad it was done so late in the and at a time that more could not have enjoyed it.

A couple of points, though:

You did not mention one of the best warbirds at the show, the Cavanaugh AD-5/EA-1E Skyraider. Enjoyed seeing it fly on Wednesday.

Also (and I am not a big T-6 fan by a long shot), I would not call the T-6/SNJ a "pseudo-warbird." It served for many years in the Army, Air Force, Navy and Marines and earned every right to be called a "warbird." Any aircraft that actually served in Military service qualifies to be called a warbird.

I knew I was leaving a plane out - I was trying to go through my head which warbirds were on the ramp and which flew. I believe the Skyraider only went up Wednesday while I was there - as they only had a warbird show Wed, Fri and Sat - might have on Tues. In the past it would do the navy legacy flights with the F-18.

I don't consider aircraft that don't serve in battle technical warbirds. The T-6 is a lot cooler than say an L-17, but I don't consider either "true" warbirds. Both had their importance in the military - if it wasn't for the T-6/SNJ then we wouldn't have had pilots to fly the P-51s, Wildcats etc.

On to the main thing - Sun N fun had a lot less planes than years past as that warbird ramp would be loaded with modern military and warbirds, same with the closed runway as well as the field between the runway and the warbird ramp and field east of the runway.

I blame some of it on the weather too. All week they forecasted doom and gloom with severe weather and a lot of rain. I think a lot of people kept their planes home afraid of another 2011 tornado. It only rained after the show Thursday night for about 20-30 minutes around 6:30pm with some thunder.

It wasn't just the warbirds that were down, it was everything. The field between the runway and VOR was just about empty and that is normally loaded with planes. The vintage aircraft were down 40% as they usually have aircraft in the overflow field east of the military on the runway. There were a lot less seaplanes than normal. The homebuilt parking on the west side of the show grounds was only half full on Friday night/onto Saturday, which are usually the busiest days. I have never seen so little movement post show either. Some of the biggest fun for me is watching all the planes take off after the show lets out. Wednesday was the busiest night by far. Thursday had a bunch try to rush out before the storm, a few took off IFR during the storm. Friday - I think literally (not joking) 20 planes departed after the show. Saturday there were only busy departures for about 20-30 min and Sunday also lasted 20-30 min. I believe a lot departed in the morning before the shows though.

[Boeing666]

No biggie Boeing 666, at least you got to go..envy.

You didn't miss much this year. I went 5 days, spent $148 in tickets for no modern military except a Texan II, and a low warbird turnout - which I believe just about every one of the warbirds there has been there in the past - no new warbirds this year to my knowledge.

Infact Sun N Fun museum had to tow some of their aircraft out on the ramp - like the Lysander, the Tempest, F-14 and P-39 just to make the ramp look less empty

[Dan K]

I don't consider aircraft that don't serve in battle technical warbirds. The T-6 is a lot cooler than say an L-17, but I don't consider either "true" warbirds...

Interestingly, you placed the "Super T-6" in the warbird category, yet classified a T-6 as a "pseudo warbird".

I don't know that a "Super T-6" ever served in combat, but the T-6 certainly has--most notably as a FAC aircraft in Korea. Try searching through the following links and then make your decision as to whether the T-6 is a battle-tested warbird or not.

http://www.mosquitokorea.org/images/572.jpg

http://www.mosquitokorea.org

Last edited by Dan K on Tue Apr 16, 2013 6:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[David J Burke]

Similarily the Navion L-17 saw service in Korea as well and certainly directed some air strikes.

I don't consider aircraft that don't serve in battle technical warbirds. The T-6 is a lot cooler than say an L-17, but I don't consider either "true" warbirds. Both had their importance in the military - if it wasn't for the T-6/SNJ then we wouldn't have had pilots to fly the P-51s, Wildcats etc.

I think that there are others who like you consider warbirds to only be those types of military aircraft that served in actual combat. I ascribe to what I believe to be the broader "WIX definition" of a vintage warbirds.....an aircraft that served in former military service. For instance to me an aircraft like a former C-121C Super Constellation both Connies in while it didn't serve in actual "battle," did serve in U.S. Military service so it is a vintage warbird, while a Constellation like the Airline History Museum's L-1049H Super Connie was built for civilian service, never served in military service, so is not a warbird.

In my definition you have two types of "warbirds," aircraft that served in actual combat or battle and those that did not.

And as mentioned above, the T-6 Texan is technically a combat/battle veteran since it served as the T-6 "Mosquito" FAC/Forward Air Control aircraft during the Korean War.

Hopefully there will be a better warbird presence at the next Sun 'n Fun!

Last edited by jwc50 on Tue Apr 16, 2013 7:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.