Bird Dog 51-12854

L2Driver · **Posted:** Fri Jul 03, 2015 3:06 pm

Anyone have any photos of L-19A 51-12854?

I've written Maxwell AFB for the movement card but haven't received anything back yet so can't offer much on its history other than it ulitmately ended up in France and was surplused in Europe. I have a few photos of it wearing French Army markings but am curious on its US use.

The airplane is currently being used as a glider tug in Franconia, NH

L-4Pilot · **Joined:** Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:35 pm **Posts:** 616

Here is some information that may help.

51-12854 L-19A
Cessna serial # 23311
Contract AF33(038)-17136
Manufactured 1-27-54
Pawnee Plant
Initial Destination US Z1 LTS (Zone of the Interior...Long Term Storage)
Cessna and or Military records indicate this aircraft was destroyed

1002 L-19 aircraft were built under this contract with serial # range 51-11912 - 51-12911

Serial # 23311 is showing up in the FAA registry as N4796G

L2Driver · **Posted:** Fri Jul 03, 2015 5:04 pm

Hope it's not destroyed. I just flew it the other day!

It carried the Cessna serial as its ID when in French service.

Photo credit to Mike Bajcar

Photo credit to John M. Guilfoil

L-4Pilot · **Joined:** Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:35 pm **Posts:** 616

A good place to start would be the FAA records on the aircraft. I think for 5 or 10 dollars you will get the complete registration history and airworthiness records.

It is not unusual to find an L-19 flying with paperwork from a destroyed aircraft, or one that has been restored using data plates and documents from another aircraft. It is possible this aircraft was damaged and restored. I have seen complete flying L-19s built up out of parts and using the logs and data plates from a completely destroyed aircraft.

The FAA records will answer most of your questions.

L2Driver · **Posted:** Fri Jul 03, 2015 6:06 pm

Thanks.

Entirely possible it was damaged, repaired and sold to France. It's an A-model but had electric flaps added at some point. Possibly upgraded prior to transfer to the French?

stevedarke · **Joined:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 3:00 am **Posts:** 12

23311 was indeed FRENCH ARMY as 23311; bought for $16,250; served in Algeria; to SVNAF; accident Feb66 South Vietnam; to N4796G; Franconia Soaring Association (Milford, NH); current Sep14

See my Bird Dog listing at http://www.thai-aviation.net/Bird_Dog.html

Steve Darke
www.thai-aviation.net

L2Driver · **Posted:** Sun Jul 05, 2015 8:56 am

Found this snippet of info. Not sure of its accuracy

The French Army Aviation received a total of 200 L-19s.

64 L-19As were supplied under MDAP from March 1954. These machines were delivered to Indochina and, after the French collapse, the survivors were handed over to the South-Vietnamese Air Force in 1955.

10 L-19As were acquired from the US Army in 1956 for evaluation purposes. They were later converted to L-19E's

126 L-19E's were bought in three batches between 1957 and 1959. These machines had been ordered new from Cessna and therefore they had no US Army serial number.

L-4Pilot · **Joined:** Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:35 pm **Posts:** 616

We had one of the French E models at Chilhowee Gliderport as a tow plane that I flew for about 8 years. Of the three A models I owned two had electric flaps and one had manual flaps.

This is 51-12079 that had the manual flaps

Steve...this is 51-12217 (N5302G) she was a glider tug before being bought by Jerry Blue, Atlanta Ga. then I owned her. You had very limited info on her.

quemerford · **Joined:** Tue Jun 17, 2014 4:19 pm **Posts:** 1593

L2Driver wrote:

Anyone have any photos of L-19A 51-12854?

I've written Maxwell AFB for the movement card but haven't received anything back yet so can't offer much on its history other than it ulitmately ended up in France and was surplused in Europe. I have a few photos of it wearing French Army markings but am curious on its US use.

The airplane is currently being used as a glider tug in Franconia, NH

Not much on the record card I'm afraid:

Contract AF-17136
available 27Jan54
accepted 04Feb54
delivered 16Feb54
Destination: Tinker AFB OK, Project USA-2L-395

Declared New Production at Wichita 04Feb54
Assigned Oklahoma Air Materiel Area Tinker AFB 10Feb54
From enroute to storage 15Feb54
to Project non-USAF 25Apr54
dropped from inventory 25Apr54

No record on the post-1955 record cards, so 25Apr54 would appear to be the 'to MAP' (France) date. No record of destruction, damage or modification in USAF inventory, so any of that (if applicable) happened after handover to France.

L2Driver · **Posted:** Sun Jul 05, 2015 1:19 pm

Thanks to those who've replied.

So, it appears this particular airplane (51-12854) didn't spend any time in US service.

It doesn't reappear on the US civil register until 1984 -- in MS. Earlier in this thread I posted a photo which, judging by the car in the background, appears taken in Europe (pretty sure it's Aerodrome Toussus-le-Nobie). The aircraft appears in French military paint -- unknown if this was immediately after it was surplused?

Andy Marden · **Posted:** Thu Jul 09, 2015 10:11 am

Yep, that is indeed Toussus. Fenwick Aviation was a major player there for many years.

Warbird Information Exchange

Bird Dog 51-12854

Who is online