CAF 109 On Barnstormers....

[Warbirdnerd]

HISPANO HA-112 BUCHON / ME-109 C4K • FOR SALE OR TRADE • Hispano HA-1112 Buchon / ME-109 C4K For sale or trade by the Commemorative Air Force for other WWII fighter type aircaft. Details avaiable by contacting Eric Van HofF, 432-563-1000 ext 2222 • Contact Eric J. Van Hoff - COMMEMORATIVE AIR FORCE located Midland, TX USA • Telephone: 432-563-1000 • Fax: 432-567-3058 • Posted March 31, 2006 • Show all Ads posted by this Advertiser • Recommend This Ad to a Friend • Send a Message

[bdk]

Have they given up on the type?

[Obergrafeter]

To preseve in flying condition at least one of every type of aircraft flown by the allies and axis powers in world war two. Creed of CAF, ooh my bad that was the Confederate Air Force which no longer exists as has been ordered by Midland to erase even the memory of it from our pschye.
The Politically Correct Air Force will continue to make such valuable decisions on trades, such as the P-82 fiasco.

[Steve Rister]

Obergrafeter, Some see the big picture, some don't...

Stephen

[Flashonyrsix]

I'm confused,how many Buchons were flown in WWII and by whom?

[Alan Brooks]

Obergrafeter, this is not about political correctness..... One of the main issues that has been with the 109 is, how SAFE is it to fly? What is one of the main topics on this board concerning Warbirds? Insurance! Midland does not have a grass strip and we all know the history and handling problems with the type. I'm sure there are a few more reasons, but PC is just not one of them... We would all love to see the He-111 still in the air..... We still have a Ju-52 3/m, Me-108, FW-44, Storch, Zero, plus all of the Tora replicas.... Regarding the P-82....... a few years ago when the trade was considered, a title was search was enacted... the title came back CLEAR! There was no lien or conditional atttachment to the title.. (Don't ask if I liked the trade.... different story). The Air Force involvement was after the trade was consumated. All I can say, but there is much more... wait and watch. Alan

[Obergrafeter]

I think all the Buchons were overrun in WWII by the Japanese T-6's with meatballs painted on them, otherwise there would have been hundreds of them.
As has gone on for years if you want to find out anything that is going on with the CAF just read it in the press because you won't find out about it from headquarters until it's a done deal. Yeah I know we are only members why should we be informed? What is good for Midland is good for us.
At last I know why we traded off our Seafire when we had no Spitfire model of any type. Of course! it is a post war model not like those WWII O-2's T-33s' and An-2s'

[Alan Brooks]

Herr Obergrafeter! Not trying to start a p*ssing contest...... but here is a bit more info and Steve Rister et al... can back this up.... The Mk 47 Seafire was an absolute mess...... Steve Rister helped load the airplane and bring it to Midland..... you could literally take a corner of the sheet metal skin and almost lift/rip the whole skin from the frames/ribs/stringers...corrosion issues, engine, you name it...... At this time, the P-51 Rednose was in horrible shape, it had been kept airworthy but really needed to be completely dis-assembled and gone through..... some of the original sponsors were getting old or had already passed on......No money was available, but a deal was struck. Basically the Seafire and Rednose went to Breckinridge. Nelson restored the P-51 and the Seafire. Of course Mr Smith eventually purchased the Seafire and invested over seven years and who knows how many $$$$$ to get that beauty airworthy. To address other issues...... The original Mk IX Spit was lost in a hanger fire with the Canadian Warplane Heritage Museum.... the engine and prop blades were the only things left because they were not in the hanger when the fire occurred. They (CWH) had no insurance on the a/c in the hanger...... A valuable airplane gone, no insurance to cover the loss...... No way to replace it at the time...... Now we have a flyable Spitfire...... not a Mk IX, but a MK XIV. It is with the So Cal Wing out in Camarillo, Ca. and Steve Barber told me personally they will be flying this summer. No, the CAF is not perfect... been over this ground before.... but I currently don't have a couple extra mill lying around to start my own museum.... which leads to my last point. The name change..... yes there was a lot of bad blood etc....... over the change......It had been brewing for some time, but "Airshow Sponsors" around the country were having a very difficult time with the name "Confederate"... OK, RR go ahead and jump on in too! Bottom line, no matter what the organization is called, unless ANY museum has a benefactor with deep pockets, you are going to have to go outside the museum for CORPORATE sponsorship. Costs just continue to go through the roof. If you fly, even worse.... So the question is, will a Fortune 500 company sponsor an organization with the name Confederate? No! Sit, gather dust or fly? What is it gonna' be? I'm looking forward to my next flight...... Alan

Last edited by Alan Brooks on Sat Apr 01, 2006 12:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.

[Alan Brooks]

Last year the bylaws were amended. We have expanded to collect and fly (when possible ) the aircraft of Korea, Vietnam, etc........... So now all of those Migs, T-33's, S-2's, and O-2's are now acceptable... in fact there is an O-2 that needs a sponsor...yes it is flying, but engines are close to overhaul time.... Alan

[bdk]

As has gone on for years if you want to find out anything that is going on with the CAF just read it in the press because you won't find out about it from headquarters until it's a done deal. Yeah I know we are only members why should we be informed? What is good for Midland is good for us. At last I know why we traded off our Seafire when we had no Spitfire model of any type. Of course! it is a post war model not like those WWII O-2's T-33s' and An-2s'

As a potential new CAF member, do you think I would even consider joining after reading a rant like this? Unless you think that joining the CAF is a very bad idea and that they are up to no good (stealing lollipops from children, etc.), why would you even post this stuff in a public forum? Will the CAF be a better organization with fewer members? In my opinion (which is worthless at best), you should find out the reasons these decisions were made, voice your dissatisfaction to the board of directors, perhaps run for the board of directors to influence the decision making, or just plain spend your money and time with another organization that is more in line with your interests.

[Alan Brooks]

My apologies, if I offended, no rant, just trying to inform........... Brian, Brad, and whoever else is a potential new member..... Everyone IS important and believe it or not, everyone does have input. Doubt it? Come to Winter or Summer Conference. It is open to all members. Brian, I rate you as having greater importance than I. You are a pilot who is almost single handedly rebuilding a T-6. In MY view, your skills far outweigh anything that I have to offer. But, we all find our niche to help, until we can expand our skill and talent levels..... It takes all kinds of people to make this work. I'm just an RN who has a passion for these aircraft and I do what I can.... when I can...... Alan

[bdk]

Alan, no, I was referring to Obergrafeter's rant. And the name is Brandon by the way... I found your post to be very informative and without a bunch of negativity.

[Alan Brooks]

OOOOPPPPSSS... My apologies again! Brain f*rt...... Alan

[Obergrafeter]

I am new to this message board so I didn't know that we can not have opinions without it being called a rant.
New to this forum, but a member of CAF for over 25 years.

[O.P.]

I am new to this message board so I didn't know that we can not have opinions without it being called a rant.
New to this forum, but a member of CAF for over 25 years.

Welcome to the board Obergrafeter.

Don't worry about it bro. We did the "CAF" thing a couple three times already. I won't say there was bad blood, but it was definately "High Spirited". And it will be every time it comes up. No biggie.

"What are they gonna do, send you to sea on a fast attack?"

Thats the way I kinda think about it. And just about everything.

Anyway, Welcome, and "CAF for over 25 years", show us some pictures dude.


Orvis