World record attempt for fastest prop-driven aircraft (P-51)

[garbs]

What's the word on Rare Bear ?
She was at Reno last year, but static.

Phil

Rod Lewis is not racing anything this year at Reno, including Rare Bear. Rumor is that he is finished with Air Racing. Can somebody confirm this?

I heard the same thing from a source at OSH. Rare Bear was to be put on display back in San Antonio and 232 is being considered for return to stock.

End of an era for Reno It appears from this thread that Strega and Voodoo will pretty much run away with Unlimited Gold this year.

Has anyone heard an update on Precious Metal? Last I heard she was being evaluated for rebuild.

[phil65]

They had Precious Metal on static display last year at Reno. I believe they were rebuilding her to race.
I bought they're t-shirt....

Phil

[OD/NG]

What's the word on Rare Bear ?
She was at Reno last year, but static.

Phil

Rod Lewis is not racing anything this year at Reno, including Rare Bear. Rumor is that he is finished with Air Racing. Can somebody confirm this?

I heard the same thing from a source at OSH. Rare Bear was to be put on display back in San Antonio and 232 is being considered for return to stock.

End of an era for Reno It appears from this thread that Strega and Voodoo will pretty much run away with Unlimited Gold this year.
Has anyone heard an update on Precious Metal? Last I heard she was being evaluated for rebuild.

Thom Richard has been quite open and forthcoming on discussing PM and air racing on facebook. In a recent post he wrote that PM will not race this year, or next and maybe not even 3 years from now. He said they were continuing, albeit slowly, to rebuild PM to race again. Reading between the lines, I got the distinct impression from this and other previous statements that the largest obstacle was funding. The fire created extensive damage to the fuselage and wing and it's going to take a whole lotta money to fix it. Thom has publicly stated that PM will race again, but I don't think it will be any time soon. Given how difficult it is to get sponsorship (read, money) for air racing programs, it wouldn't surprise me if it took 7 to 10 years before we see PM rounding the pylons again.

[phil65]

I guess the t-shirt fund isn't enough...

Phil

[OD/NG]

I guess the t-shirt fund isn't enough...

Phil

No, probably only about 1.5 Million short. But, if Thom sells t-shirts to a little more than half the entire population of Reno, then he'd be back in business!

[phil65]

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/po ... wo-n795591

Maybe whistlingdeath77 knows her.... and she's into warbirds....

Phil

[garbs]

Thom Richard has been quite open and forthcoming on discussing PM and air racing on facebook. In a recent post he wrote that PM will not race this year, or next and maybe not even 3 years from now. He said they were continuing, albeit slowly, to rebuild PM to race again. Reading between the lines, I got the distinct impression from this and other previous statements that the largest obstacle was funding. The fire created extensive damage to the fuselage and wing and it's going to take a whole lotta money to fix it. Thom has publicly stated that PM will race again, but I don't think it will be any time soon. Given how difficult it is to get sponsorship (read, money) for air racing programs, it wouldn't surprise me if it took 7 to 10 years before we see PM rounding the pylons again.

Thanks for the update, OD/NG. I don't do Facebook so I haven't followed. I have two shirts, though, and may guppy in for a third this year.

Too bad the fire crew wasn't a little quicker on the draw - Thom is a class act and a definite fan favorite. Maybe PM will be up in the 650 MPH class when she's done

[kalamazookid]

Not to hijack the thread, but I saw pieces of Precious Metal when I visited the Warbird Adventures/Kissimmee Air Museum hangar early in March. It's hard to get a feel for how substantial the remains of Precious Metal are because they are so scattered around the hangar. The most substantial pieces I saw intact were the rear turtledeck and tail cone. Also saw props/spinners, pieces of cowling, various Griffon engine parts and spare prop blades. Perhaps others have better details on what remains.

Here are some photos of what I saw.

IMG_4065 by Matthew Vader, on Flickr

IMG_4097 by Matthew Vader, on Flickr

IMG_4105 by Matthew Vader, on Flickr

IMG_4102 by Matthew Vader, on Flickr

IMG_4096 by Matthew Vader, on Flickr

IMG_4075 by Matthew Vader, on Flickr

IMG_4066 by Matthew Vader, on Flickr

[CJAM427]

Just as an FYI, because Rare Bear's record run was in 1989, it's actually no longer the "Fastest Internal Combustion Aeroplane" according to the FAI. Sometime after that, they changed the Internal Combustion Aeroplane class to have sub-classes for weight (a - d). As such, the standing record was "retired" and currently the Yak-3U "SteadFast" flown by Will Whiteside, Jr., is actually the current record holder in the C-1d class at a mere 669.63 km/h (416.09 mph) set in October 2011 at Wendover, UT. The next closest record is for the C-1c category and is held by John Sharp in his Nemesis NXT at 669.08 km/h (415.78 mph), set in September 2015 in Moriarty, NM.

Interestingly, the current C-1d Turboprop 3km closed course record is significantly slower at 449.71 km/h (279.44 mph) set by a TBM-700 out of Las Cruces, NM. The absolute record for a 3km course is held by a Lancair Turbine IV-P at 570.33 km/h (354.39 mph).

Important of note here - all the closed course speed records currently active were flown from airports with a field elevation around 5000 feet MSL.

The "absolute" Closed Course record for Turboprops appears to be held by the Tu-142 (a modified version of the Tu-95) at 834.28 km/h (518.40 mph) over a 2000km course. Next to several Tu-142/Tu-95 records, the next fastest airplane over a closed course is the C-130J which achieved a speed of 637.58 km/h (396.17 mph) over a 1000 km course. After that, you drop below 500 km/h for a closed course. There are straight line and point-to-point records above that, but all of those I don't count because they allow weather to factor in (i.e. they're all Eastbound flights between cities and likely got significant Jet Stream help).

PS - I tried to write this post this afternoon but got busy and wasn't able to finish the research. Sadly the FAI doesn't have a great search engine to find the standing records.

I think as far as the team is concerned, Rare Bear's record is the one they want to break.

[exhaustgases]

Wow sure looks like a lot of weight on the nose of that Griffon. I still think its funny that they don't use a swept wing like at least an F86, or better when trying to break a speed record.
And rotate the prop nice and fast like this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51BEbZlps80
And most important listen to 4:46 or so to 4:48 they mention the rpms. Its called thinking out of the box.

[C VEICH]

Wow sure looks like a lot of weight on the nose of that Griffon. I still think its funny that they don't use a swept wing like at least an F86, or better when trying to break a speed record.
And rotate the prop nice and fast like this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51BEbZlps80
And most important listen to 4:46 or so to 4:48 they mention the rpms. Its called thinking out of the box.

I suppose that even people like Bob Button are limited by their budgets. And even if money were no object you gotta ask yourself how much are you willing to spend for the simple pleasure of having your name in the record books?

[OD/NG]

Wow sure looks like a lot of weight on the nose of that Griffon. I still think its funny that they don't use a swept wing like at least an F86, or better when trying to break a speed record.
And rotate the prop nice and fast like this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51BEbZlps80
And most important listen to 4:46 or so to 4:48 they mention the rpms. Its called thinking out of the box.

I suppose that even people like Bob Button are limited by their budgets. And even if money were no object you gotta ask yourself how much are you willing to spend for the simple pleasure of having your name in the record books?

Exactly!

Also, keep in mind that the "scimitar prop" was tried on an Unlimited racer back in the 90's. The result was not successful and cost too much money. Given a budget like NASA, I'm sure somebody could have made it work for an Unlimited racer.

Also, a swept wing has already been tried on an Unlimited racer. It was called "Vendetta" / "Miss Ashley II". It ended up with disastrous consequences and killed a well known race pilot.

[sandiego89]

Also, a swept wing has already been tried on an Unlimited racer. It was called "Vendetta" / "Miss Ashley II". It ended up with disastrous consequences and killed a well known race pilot.

But as I recall, the cause of the crash was likely a trim tab or flutter issue on the tail- not an inherit flaw or direct "consequence" of the moderately swept (tapered?) lear-jet wing. A true swept wing as most define it (ala' f-86 shape) has been mused about, but not applied to an unlimited.

All the best for the record attempt team! It is quite a testament to see how long the record stayed with the me 209, Conquest 1, and Rare Bear.

[CJAM427]

Also, a swept wing has already been tried on an Unlimited racer. It was called "Vendetta" / "Miss Ashley II". It ended up with disastrous consequences and killed a well known race pilot.

But as I recall, the cause of the crash was likely a trim tab or flutter issue on the tail- not an inherit flaw or direct "consequence" of the moderately swept (tapered?) lear-jet wing. A true swept wing as most define it (ala' f-86 shape) has been mused about, but not applied to an unlimited.

All the best for the record attempt team! It is quite a testament to see how long the record stayed with the me 209, Conquest 1, and Rare Bear.

Any time Miss Ashley II comes up, there's talk that the swept wing wasn't the best for the Reno race course, but supposedly in level flight it could really haul the mail. It was still in the development stages when it crashed though. If it is true that the swept wing wasn't the best at Reno, it would be even more true now since the race course is much tighter.

In Voodoo's case, from what I understand, the sponsor had the wing analyzed and figured that with a little modification it would be able to break the record. A lot less expensive than building a new wing or adapting a different one.

Oh and don't forget the Red Baron! Funny that Conquest, Baron and Bear's records are all 10 years apart. It is fitting though as each one was the dominant force in air racing when they set their records.

[sandiego89]

Oh and don't forget the Red Baron! Funny that Conquest, Baron and Bear's records are all 10 years apart. It is fitting though as each one was the dominant force in air racing when they set their records.

Ahh, shame on me for missing Red Baron- thank you for the add.