CAF P-40N mishap? ...

[ZRX61]

Can the gear handle be pulled up and the gear retract on the ground like the P-38? Could there have been a mistake between the gear handle and the flaps or other handle? I don't know the P-40, just asking.

Yes, but what usually happens is the tail wheel retracts first & it results in a crunch to the bottom of the rudder.

[Taylor Stevenson]

Can the gear handle be pulled up and the gear retract on the ground like the P-38? Could there have been a mistake between the gear handle and the flaps or other handle? I don't know the P-40, just asking.

The gear can be raised on the ground, however that is 100% not the case here. As mentioned above, tailwheel would collapse and so would the right MLG, unless it was loaded in such a way to keep it forward.

[OD/NG]

Can the gear handle be pulled up and the gear retract on the ground like the P-38? Could there have been a mistake between the gear handle and the flaps or other handle? I don't know the P-40, just asking.

The gear can be raised on the ground, however that is 100% not the case here. As mentioned above, tailwheel would collapse and so would the right MLG, unless it was loaded in such a way to keep it forward.

So what is the suspected cause of what happened?

[CraigQ]

Can the gear handle be pulled up and the gear retract on the ground like the P-38? Could there have been a mistake between the gear handle and the flaps or other handle? I don't know the P-40, just asking.

The gear can be raised on the ground, however that is 100% not the case here. As mentioned above, tailwheel would collapse and so would the right MLG, unless it was loaded in such a way to keep it forward.

So what is the suspected cause of what happened?

Each retract cylinder on a P-40 has internal mechanical locks that lock each one in up/down position. It is possible for the locks in one cylinder to fail and cause that leg to collapse on the ground or fail to uplock if taking off. I am NOT saying that is what happened. Having seen this once before, just trying to add a little clarity.

[OD/NG]

Each retract cylinder on a P-40 has internal mechanical locks that lock each one in up/down position. It is possible for the locks in one cylinder to fail and cause that leg to collapse on the ground or fail to uplock if taking off. I am NOT saying that is what happened. Having seen this once before, just trying to add a little clarity.

Thanks for the info.

[Deuelly]

Each retract cylinder on a P-40 has internal mechanical locks that lock each one in up/down position. It is possible for the locks in one cylinder to fail and cause that leg to collapse on the ground or fail to uplock if taking off. I am NOT saying that is what happened. Having seen this once before, just trying to add a little clarity.

It's nearly impossible for the P-40 gear locks to fail once locked in. Structure would rip out, or the gear activating links would buckle before the lock's would physically sheer off. While the gear can fail to lock up or down for a few reasons, the pilot should have adequate warning through the gear warning system. P-40 gear is pretty stout. Even lacking hydraulic pressure the main gear will stay locked once down.

Brandon

[Dave Hadfield]

I don’t know what happened in the incident.

It’s very easy to make a mistake with the P-40 gear. You have to trap hydraulic pressure in the cylinder. If the pressure bleeds off the internal locks disengage. So after extension, and double check with the hand lever, you must move the selector to Off.

Really Big Gotcha.

And after landing, it’s easy to grab the wrong selector and retract Gear instead of Flaps. They are side by side.

Not a good system, but it was all New in 1935 for the P-36.

[Deuelly]

I don’t know what happened in the incident.

It’s very easy to make a mistake with the P-40 gear. You have to trap hydraulic pressure in the cylinder. If the pressure bleeds off the internal locks disengage. So after extension, and double check with the hand lever, you must move the selector to Off.

Really Big Gotcha.

And after landing, it’s easy to grab the wrong selector and retract Gear instead of Flaps. They are side by side.

Not a good system, but it was all New in 1935 for the P-36.

Dave, the P-40 gear is designed to stay locked even if you lose hydraulic pressure. I do agree though that if not flying with a clear head you could grab the wrong lever when going for the flaps.

Brandon