Wed May 09, 2007 11:41 pm
There are many ways to serve this country without doing military service. Today is not like WWII, and thankfully, there hasn't been another war like it since. Today's military is lean and mean, all volunteer and a bit overstretched.
I served 4 years as a much younger man than I am now. I was single and had little commitments that I had to meet. I thought going in during the cold war that there was always a risk of war, but figured it was remote. I ended up spending my last 18 months working in Special Operations and it was quite an eye opener to what can, and does happen. I saw the best and worst that mankind can dish out to their fellow man and it has forever altered how I look at things.
I can't say I fully understand your guilt at not having served because I am not in that position. But I will say this: you have family and a full life. You said yourself that you don't have time for reserve duty. It's a commitment you have to make, and you run a risk of being deployed to Iraq. That's 15 months where you will be away from your home, your family and friends, and likely a long, hot shower.
Think real long and hard about it before you decide to do it, if you do. Many good men have died over there. There doesn't look to be any easy end in sight either. Think about your family, what happens to them if you don't come home? I know these are tough questions, but you need to look at that.
I saw men, boys really, get killed in the line of fire. It's nothing like the movies. It's tough, it's gritty, it sucks and it changes you FOREVER. Surviving is little solace when your good friends blood has dried on your shirt and you can smell it for the rest of the op. It's a really sh!tty reminder that Joe, or Bill, or whomever is no longer with you. If you can go through 15 months of that and still be the same person you were when you left, you are a better man than I.
You don't need to serve to be a better American. If your only reason for wanting to serve is to honor those who came before, you don't need to serve to do that. Visit a VA hospital, thank the vets there. They have paid a heavy price for the freedoms we have today, and many of them are still suffering from it now. Just sit an listen to them, be their friend. What a smile and a thank you can do for a vet who has been suffering may sound like a little, but it's likely more than he gets most of the time.
I know I got a little long winded here, but I want you to really know that serving is not for the meek. It has to be in your heart and soul to be a warrior. It's not something you make time for. Being a soldier takes responsibility unlike anything in civilian life. Decisions made in military service can cost lives, whether they were good or bad decisions. Dealing with the consequences of those actions is something that lasts a lifetime.
I served 4 years as a much younger man than I am now. I was single and had little commitments that I had to meet. I thought going in during the cold war that there was always a risk of war, but figured it was remote. I ended up spending my last 18 months working in Special Operations and it was quite an eye opener to what can, and does happen. I saw the best and worst that mankind can dish out to their fellow man and it has forever altered how I look at things.
I can't say I fully understand your guilt at not having served because I am not in that position. But I will say this: you have family and a full life. You said yourself that you don't have time for reserve duty. It's a commitment you have to make, and you run a risk of being deployed to Iraq. That's 15 months where you will be away from your home, your family and friends, and likely a long, hot shower.
Think real long and hard about it before you decide to do it, if you do. Many good men have died over there. There doesn't look to be any easy end in sight either. Think about your family, what happens to them if you don't come home? I know these are tough questions, but you need to look at that.
I saw men, boys really, get killed in the line of fire. It's nothing like the movies. It's tough, it's gritty, it sucks and it changes you FOREVER. Surviving is little solace when your good friends blood has dried on your shirt and you can smell it for the rest of the op. It's a really sh!tty reminder that Joe, or Bill, or whomever is no longer with you. If you can go through 15 months of that and still be the same person you were when you left, you are a better man than I.
You don't need to serve to be a better American. If your only reason for wanting to serve is to honor those who came before, you don't need to serve to do that. Visit a VA hospital, thank the vets there. They have paid a heavy price for the freedoms we have today, and many of them are still suffering from it now. Just sit an listen to them, be their friend. What a smile and a thank you can do for a vet who has been suffering may sound like a little, but it's likely more than he gets most of the time.
I know I got a little long winded here, but I want you to really know that serving is not for the meek. It has to be in your heart and soul to be a warrior. It's not something you make time for. Being a soldier takes responsibility unlike anything in civilian life. Decisions made in military service can cost lives, whether they were good or bad decisions. Dealing with the consequences of those actions is something that lasts a lifetime.
Wed May 09, 2007 11:54 pm
Wow! Very powerful writting. Well said.
Thu May 10, 2007 6:35 am
Also speaking of Band of Brothers, check out my Speirs thread.
Thu May 10, 2007 8:04 am
Vg,
Thanks for the moving words and your service. I had the honor to work with Special Ops guys and they are the best of the best. Thank God for those guys. On the aviation side, I didn't see things up close like you did, just a few glimpses from afar and on a few occasions the aftermath on medevac missions and at funerals so I had it relatively easy compared to guys on the ground. My hat's off to guys like you and John Peters who were the boots on the ground doing the heavy lifting while the flyers got to go back to the relatively safe, comfortable air bases at the end of the missions (most of the time).
Join up if you have a warrior spirit or feel a higher calling, but the stakes are pretty high right now, so I wouldn't advise doing it out of guilt, need for college $, or a job. No need to feel guilty otherwise.
Thanks for the moving words and your service. I had the honor to work with Special Ops guys and they are the best of the best. Thank God for those guys. On the aviation side, I didn't see things up close like you did, just a few glimpses from afar and on a few occasions the aftermath on medevac missions and at funerals so I had it relatively easy compared to guys on the ground. My hat's off to guys like you and John Peters who were the boots on the ground doing the heavy lifting while the flyers got to go back to the relatively safe, comfortable air bases at the end of the missions (most of the time).
Join up if you have a warrior spirit or feel a higher calling, but the stakes are pretty high right now, so I wouldn't advise doing it out of guilt, need for college $, or a job. No need to feel guilty otherwise.
Thu May 10, 2007 9:01 am
vg-photo wrote:I can't say I fully understand your guilt at not having served because I am not in that position. But I will say this: you have family and a full life. You said yourself that you don't have time for reserve duty. It's a commitment you have to make, and you run a risk of being deployed to Iraq. That's 15 months where you will be away from your home, your family and friends, and likely a long, hot shower.
Think real long and hard about it before you decide to do it, if you do. Many good men have died over there. There doesn't look to be any easy end in sight either. Think about your family, what happens to them if you don't come home? I know these are tough questions, but you need to look at that.
There's a lot of good and sound advice in there. Believe me I can imagine the sacrifices that would need to be made to go into the reserves. I am more than happy to do my part for my country. My reservations come with the impact on my business and the 160 families that rely on me there as well as my own. This is definately not a decision I would jump into. I've talked to my wife about it and she is totally against it. She doesn't understand and never will. So then I risk my own family as well. It certainly sounds like a bad idea, but something inside of me keeps telling me to go for it.
Perhaps you are right about the VA hospital. Maybe that is a better use of my time and energy.
On the phone with Walter Reed Medical Center now....
Thu May 10, 2007 9:07 am
Well this has got to be the dumbest thing I've ever heard. I spoke with the visitors center at Walter Reed (I'm down in the area today and thought why not try to get up there today). THey said you have to make an appointment, and the appointments are3 weeks out!!! STUPID!!!!
Thu May 10, 2007 10:15 am
Thu May 10, 2007 7:37 pm
I think that military service is a calling, and certainly not for everyone. I think that every American should be motivated -- compelled -- to take part of some aspect of our republic, but there are many, many different ways to do that. Public service takes many forms, each filling an important aspect of furthering the "American Democratic Experiment".
I never think any less of someone who hasn't been in the military -- but I would think less of someone who is so apathetic about the freedom Americans enjoy (and which was earned and maintained with American blood) that they don't take an active part in our civil process.
For what it's worth, I am actually currently sitting at Bagram AB, Afghanistan as I write this post, having just returned from a 4.6 hour combat sortie flying in support of US Special Operations Forces as part of OEF.
Freedom isn't free.
I never think any less of someone who hasn't been in the military -- but I would think less of someone who is so apathetic about the freedom Americans enjoy (and which was earned and maintained with American blood) that they don't take an active part in our civil process.
For what it's worth, I am actually currently sitting at Bagram AB, Afghanistan as I write this post, having just returned from a 4.6 hour combat sortie flying in support of US Special Operations Forces as part of OEF.
Freedom isn't free.
Thu May 10, 2007 8:39 pm
Randy,
Thanks ....
Tomorrow morning I will feel extra pleased as I spend time volunteering at the National Museum of the United States Air Force knowing that I will be "a keeper of your story" as well as those who proceeded you.
And "God Speed".
Jerry
Thanks ....
Tomorrow morning I will feel extra pleased as I spend time volunteering at the National Museum of the United States Air Force knowing that I will be "a keeper of your story" as well as those who proceeded you.
And "God Speed".
Jerry
Volunteers
Thu May 10, 2007 9:15 pm
An interesting Vet story from Denver; two men just voluntered to serve in Iraq or Afgan.?, not young people or those looking for a job. Ist Dave Nida who is a doctor. perhaps 50? Next Tom Silva who is 57? Amazingly Tom served in combat in Vietnam, but wants to go again. He is a helicopter pilot for channel 4 tv, so very likely will be in combat or combat areas. I don't think either one is trying to make a name for themselves such as a military or a political future. they just feel this inside. Are they foolhardy or brave or a bit of both?
Thu May 10, 2007 9:39 pm
Randy, as a veteran of Lakenheath myself, I am proud to know that there are men like you who continue to carry the torch of freedom. Thanks!
I don't put down anyone who didn't or hasn't served. Like you said, doing something for your country can take many different forms. And the military is not for everyone.
I don't put down anyone who didn't or hasn't served. Like you said, doing something for your country can take many different forms. And the military is not for everyone.
Thu May 10, 2007 10:04 pm
Randy wrote:having just returned from a 4.6 hour combat sortie flying in support of US Special Operations Forces as part of OEF
Thanks Randy
For supporting the Spec Ops community.
I've lost alot of friends in the past 6 years. I'm glad that I know the name of one of the angels looking over them.
Shay
_____________
Semper Fortis
Thu May 10, 2007 11:01 pm
Well lads, time for a 56 year old to share his guilt.
Grew up an Air Force brat (not to be confused with that sausage) and in '70, lost my deferrment to a processing glitch. Went through the 12 hour "underware" initiation. Passed the color, shape, and logic tests. When they found I had 20/10 vision, I became real popular.
As the son of a great fighter pilot, I thought, OK, it's time. AF wanted OCS, the Academy, etc. the Army said, "Boy, you don't want those fixed wings, we can have you in the air in rotary wing aircraft darn fast."
On the eve of the decision deadline, snafu corrected, student deferrment in hand, problem solved....
Years go by. Dad and I become terminally estranged until just prior to his death. Was that due to me not following in his footsteps????
Many lads my age did go to SE Asia and serve. Did I drop the ball for the easy way out? Now that I am upside down with warbirds, wanting to get my PPL, having the first aircraft that I ever controlled be T33 Driver's Shooting Star...("I know that I looked to Dad for assistance there and got it"), I question what did I miss?
I can't go back and take a "do over". If I could, would I do someting different? I think maybe so but now I have that other perspective that I didn't have then.
I know that now I deal with my "guilt" by seeking out, recognizing, and thanking every veteran that I meet. I'm sure that I come across as some sort of "dillwad" but that is my payback.
To everyone on this forum who has stepped up to the plate and served our Country, thank you. To the rest of us that may be in the weeds like me, don't be afraid to approach, introduce yourself, and say thanks.
"Old Fart, over & out."
Grew up an Air Force brat (not to be confused with that sausage) and in '70, lost my deferrment to a processing glitch. Went through the 12 hour "underware" initiation. Passed the color, shape, and logic tests. When they found I had 20/10 vision, I became real popular.
As the son of a great fighter pilot, I thought, OK, it's time. AF wanted OCS, the Academy, etc. the Army said, "Boy, you don't want those fixed wings, we can have you in the air in rotary wing aircraft darn fast."
On the eve of the decision deadline, snafu corrected, student deferrment in hand, problem solved....
Years go by. Dad and I become terminally estranged until just prior to his death. Was that due to me not following in his footsteps????
Many lads my age did go to SE Asia and serve. Did I drop the ball for the easy way out? Now that I am upside down with warbirds, wanting to get my PPL, having the first aircraft that I ever controlled be T33 Driver's Shooting Star...("I know that I looked to Dad for assistance there and got it"), I question what did I miss?
I can't go back and take a "do over". If I could, would I do someting different? I think maybe so but now I have that other perspective that I didn't have then.
I know that now I deal with my "guilt" by seeking out, recognizing, and thanking every veteran that I meet. I'm sure that I come across as some sort of "dillwad" but that is my payback.
To everyone on this forum who has stepped up to the plate and served our Country, thank you. To the rest of us that may be in the weeds like me, don't be afraid to approach, introduce yourself, and say thanks.
"Old Fart, over & out."
Fri May 11, 2007 1:22 am
Randy Haskin wrote:Freedom isn't free.
No, it is not...
Thank you, Randy
Fri May 11, 2007 5:06 am
When I signed-up to join the Air Force back in 1981, I remeber signing-up out of a patriotic duty of some sort as well as a desire to be around things that fly 
20-some years later, when I thank other vets for their service during WWII, Korea or Vietnam, I feel kind of odd when they thank me also for serving I certainly don't feel as though I am on the same level as them. As far as the mess in Iraq today, I shake the hand of every vet from over there every chance I get, but think it is such a shame that so many young people are sacrificing everything for nothing. I know that most of the troops over there are not fighting and sacrificing for "freedom, justice and the American way"...they are just trying to survive, keep an eye on their buddies and hope to make it back home to their families in one piece. I love my country and my brothers in arms...it is the government I can do without!
20-some years later, when I thank other vets for their service during WWII, Korea or Vietnam, I feel kind of odd when they thank me also for serving I certainly don't feel as though I am on the same level as them. As far as the mess in Iraq today, I shake the hand of every vet from over there every chance I get, but think it is such a shame that so many young people are sacrificing everything for nothing. I know that most of the troops over there are not fighting and sacrificing for "freedom, justice and the American way"...they are just trying to survive, keep an eye on their buddies and hope to make it back home to their families in one piece. I love my country and my brothers in arms...it is the government I can do without!