One Stop Line for News & Pics from Thunder over Michigan

[TheNetwerk]

Hey Mike, Kevin and Tom, I have heard a lot of grumbling about the show and complaints on here and Fence Check and I just want to show some support for you guys. I for one have been around shows long enough to know most of the problems you face organizing a warbird show and know many issues can crop up to prevent an aircraft from attending. I never expect to see all the aircraft listed to attend the show, to many factors that can prevent that. I for one did not find the show any less exciting then the past shows and really appreciate having the event in the area as it is our top warbird show in the region by far and I for one do not want to see that change. Two Spits, 3 Hurricanes and a Lanc is pretty darn impressive not to mention very expensive for a show. Add to this an excellent line-up of WWII aircraft that all had to have appearances paid. I really like how every year TOM brings in new aircraft to the show so it never gets stale.

I would however say that GA suffered this year with the tents in the most sought after spot blocking the view as well as some venders placed along the north show line. Other then that I did not see a difference from past years and the flying and passes was excellent.

Keep up the great work and I’m looking forward to next year.

Eric

I dont know about you, but I havent seen anyone not supporting the Y.A.F. and the coordinators. I havent seen 1 entry/thread that said the show was a sucktacular.

There are people (like myself) putting up their reviews/experiences with the show in hopes that people who can make a difference, will read them and will listen to what supporters say the liked/could use some work.

There really arent people complaining about the no-shows, from everything I've seen. People understand that warbirds are a huge undertaking, heck -- flying anything to/in an airshow is a huge undertaking, but warbirds are especially fragile. I think people are upset over the lack of info from the Y.A.F. moreso than the planes not actually showing up... My biggest "gripe" is the total lack of info/updates from the coordinators/staff. It doesnt take much to stick something up on the website or insert a piece of paper into the program/flyers they handed out to be people in their cars..

As Eric says, keep up the great work.

I too am looking forward to next year!

[TheNetwerk]

I find it a bit annoying when people complain about aircraft no shows. Especially people who should know better. Maintainance, personal, and $$ issues stress all owers/pilots. We should thank those who put their blood and $$ into organizing these shows.

I missed the show, because if I don't work, I don't fly.
I'm saving all I can to get my UH-1H flying ASAP.

Even though I was not there, Thanks to Mike and all the YAM staff who put on the show.

I dont think people are complaining about the no-shows, as much as people are whining about. From what I've seen repeatedly, people are upset that there wasnt any info about cancellations or no-shows. We all understand how difficult it is to maintain a warbird, especially for airshow flying -- so I really dont think the planes not showing up is all that upsetting to people. Sure it's disappointing to think you're going to see some things, and then they dont show up for whatever reason. But I think we all are very understanding and supportive of the mechanics/pilots/companies/ etc etc and just hope to see them next time..

[TheNetwerk]

There is a big difference between “whining” and “constructive criticisms”. A lot of it has to do with how you choose to word your (not you but the persons in question) posts what you feel is wrong. There are several people here how gave some insight and advice on how the show could be improved with out going on and on about how these planes did not show up, did not fly enough or I ordered a coke and they gave me a Pepsi…


I really can’t believe how many complaints I’m hearing about the show with out at least a tiny bit about how great it was also. Come on, 3 Hurricanes, 2 Spitfires, Bf-109, 2 B-17s P-38J, AD-5 A-4, a number of P-51s. That is a great show to me; let’s help refine this show and layout without kicking the people who worked SO HARD in the Balls. It might not be happening here as much as other MB but I’m a bit stunned number of complaints.

THANK YOU YAF! GREAT JOB AND MAY NEXT YEAR BE BETTER!

Tim

I have yet to see someone whining. If anything, I've seen people give their opinions/reviews/experiences and a lot of people are frustrated over the same things. I think it's funny to see you whining about how you believe other people are whining, though.

Not all of us are perfect with words, so sometimes things dont read they way they are intended, but I dont know anyone who always can write/come off how they intend. Part of it is on the reader, if the reader is in a bad mood, a great review can come over as whiney -- and that's not the writers fault. Also, often I'm seeing people only read -part- of a review, or not really read/pat attention to whats being "said" then the writer is blasted for having an opinion and sharing a review? Grow up.

No one's kicking anyone. There are just a lot of folks that would like to see the same things changed, we all support the Y.A.M. and applaud all the time/energy/effort/money/etc that went into the show -- do not forget that, and kick us in the balls for writing our reviews.

[mrhenniger]

My biggest "gripe" is the total lack of info/updates from the coordinators/staff. It doesnt take much to stick something up on the website or insert a piece of paper into the program/flyers they handed out to be people in their cars..

Just a minute ago I address this point on another thread...
http://warbirdinformationexchange.org/p ... php?t=8463

My disappointment is with the T.o.M coordinators/planners/staffers who never really notified the supporters of planes inability to be there. They shouted from the roof tops when something was scheduled/confirmed, but kept rather silent when it had to cancel, leaving many supporters to believe it'd still be there.

I could not disagree more. YAF organizers posted on WIX a number of times indicating when the list was updated. Even when the event drew nearer they were posting additions and deletions lists in addition to the overall list. Very few shows do that, even fewer (and the YAF is one of the fewer) make the extra effort to let you know what can't make it. And on top of that, some times you don't know an aircraft is not showing until the day of the show. You can't possibly advertise that kind of last minute update.

I am just getting back on WIX after attending Thunder and a week of vacation. Congrats to the Yankee Air Force Museum for putting on another excellant show. As requested by Todd Hackbarth I will be putting together a list of comments regarding what worked well and what didn't.

I am looking forward to the next Thunder.

Mike

The YAF certainly did make an effort to provide updates of aircraft that could make it. I politely suggest you do a search on some of the threads here on WIX about Thunder leading up to the show. You will see what I am talking about.

Mike

[TheNetwerk]

Well I see this board is no different than any other board. You post your opinion on the show, and if others don't like it you are labled as a WHINER or a COMPLANER?? WTF ?? The way the show was setup with the vendors taking show line was just not a good idea. You forced too many people into a small fenceline which will always cause problems. I for one brought my kids to see the show ( a great history lesson in the re-enactment which no school could teach ) and all they learned was how to say the F BOMB from all the dinks with big lens DSLR's trying to get the good shots that were too cheap to get photo pit passes.
Maybe for you guys this is ok but I don't need my kids hearing that crap.

Dave

I couldnt agree more. If people dont like your opinion/review, your sharing, or the words you choose to use, they are rude to you to the Nth degree. It's immature and very non-productive.

There were things that could be improved, just as there were things that were AMAZING and should not change one bit.

And ya, it seemed that the bigger the lens, the worse the attitude/filthier the language.. I dont know that there's anything that can be done about that..

[TheNetwerk]

My biggest "gripe" is the total lack of info/updates from the coordinators/staff. It doesnt take much to stick something up on the website or insert a piece of paper into the program/flyers they handed out to be people in their cars..

Just a minute ago I address this point on another thread...
http://warbirdinformationexchange.org/p ... php?t=8463

My disappointment is with the T.o.M coordinators/planners/staffers who never really notified the supporters of planes inability to be there. They shouted from the roof tops when something was scheduled/confirmed, but kept rather silent when it had to cancel, leaving many supporters to believe it'd still be there.

I could not disagree more. YAF organizers posted on WIX a number of times indicating when the list was updated. Even when the event drew nearer they were posting additions and deletions lists in addition to the overall list. Very few shows do that, even fewer (and the YAF is one of the fewer) make the extra effort to let you know what can't make it. And on top of that, some times you don't know an aircraft is not showing until the day of the show. You can't possibly advertise that kind of last minute update.

I am just getting back on WIX after attending Thunder and a week of vacation. Congrats to the Yankee Air Force Museum for putting on another excellant show. As requested by Todd Hackbarth I will be putting together a list of comments regarding what worked well and what didn't.

I am looking forward to the next Thunder.

Mike

The YAF certainly did make an effort to provide updates of aircraft that could make it. I politely suggest you do a search on some of the threads here on WIX about Thunder leading up to the show. You will see what I am talking about.

Mike

See, I'm new to WIXers and I think it's to say that the overwhelming majority of people in attendence were not WIXers. They were just average people wanting to see a show. And then there were some warbird buffs that came to see specific things that maybe are older and not "down" with technology so much. It's great that they posted here, but sadly not all warbird enthuasists are on here. It wouldnt be hard to slip a piece of paper in with the packet that was handed up to people in their cars. Nor would have been hard to update the official plane list's website, which was not done and what I believe most people used for info. And you could have had the announcers say something as well, that wouldnt be too hard and could be helpful for last minute stuff.

I never said that they made absolutley no attempts to give info out. But, the overwhelming majority of people did not have info about what'd be performing/static and what was/wasnt showing up and why. Of course some people who are a part of fencecheck/WIXers knew, but that accounts for what.. 5% of the total audience being informed?

I hope your "list" will be fairly representative of people's experiences, but from your apparent baditude I dont believe it will be.

[Ontario-Warbird]

I told myself I would not get involved in this anymore because I am not very good at expressing myself on forums, but here it goes.

As for planes not showing up, it happens and has been greatly explained by the pilots and organizers of the show. The only thing said on this forum is that some people ( myself included ) were disappointed in the lack of Spits, and im sure the YAM were too but it happens ( talking to Jim B of the Russell group we might have only had one if it were not for Mr. Greenwood taking the controls of MK912 for the Russell Group. I think everyone should give him a big thank you for a great display)

As for Mike, Eric and Tim I would think you guys were it the photo pit on Saturday? So you didn't really get to see and hear the battles along the small fence line near the B52. Saturday for myself was a familly day with the kids and Sunday was the photo tour and pit pass day. But with all the angry people I had to hear on Saturday swearing at each other I decided to not bother with Sunday. Now I'm not faulting the organizers for the actions of a bunch of foul mouth people but would ask that they re-arrange the layout to provide more fenceline for spectators.

One thing that has not been brought up too much was the great display by the P47's and P51 over the Battle Re-enactment, very low passes Wish I could have placed myself in the middle of the bean field with my video camera

Looking forward to next year,

Dave C

[TheNetwerk]

I told myself I would not get involved in this anymore because I am not very good at expressing myself on forums, but here it goes.

As for planes not showing up, it happens and has been greatly explained by the pilots and organizers of the show. The only thing said on this forum is that some people ( myself included ) were disappointed in the lack of Spits, and im sure the YAM were too but it happens ( talking to Jim B of the Russell group we might have only had one if it were not for Mr. Greenwood taking the controls of MK912 for the Russell Group. I think everyone should give him a big thank you for a great display)

As for Mike, Eric and Tim I would think you guys were it the photo pit on Saturday? So you didn't really get to see and hear the battles along the small fence line near the B52. Saturday for myself was a familly day with the kids and Sunday was the photo tour and pit pass day. But with all the angry people I had to hear on Saturday swearing at each other I decided to not bother with Sunday. Now I'm not faulting the organizers for the actions of a bunch of foul mouth people but would ask that they re-arrange the layout to provide more fenceline for spectators.

One thing that has not been brought up too much was the great display by the P47's and P51 over the Battle Re-enactment, very low passes Wish I could have placed myself in the middle of the bean field with my video camera

Looking forward to next year,

Dave C

I got some of my best/favourite pictures of the airshow from the low flying of the P-47's and the P-51, I may have some video if you'd be interested? Just little clips though..

[TheNetwerk]

My review/experience of the show can be found here: http://warbirdinformationexchange.org/p ... php?t=8463

I'm not putting it up to be blasted/disrespected for sharing my experiece, so if that's on your agenda, save it. I greatly appreciate all the pilots/mechanics/companies who provided the Y.A.M. with planes to show, the show was amazing and I enjoyed seeing the planes upclose. And to those who couldnt make it, thanks for your efforts, hope you're able to come next year!

I havent invested thousands of dollars in equipment, nor am I a professional photographer, so these might not be as up close/personal as some other peoples photos. Also, I have some video, but it's not uploaded so if there's something you'd like to see, reply with what it is and if i have it i'll upload it and send a link


Friday:







Sat:










Sun:

Last edited by TheNetwerk on Mon Aug 14, 2006 2:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[mrhenniger]

I'm not putting it up to be blasted/disrespected for sharing my experiece, so if that's on your agenda, save it.

You certainly don't mind doing the disrespecting yourself. May I suggest you save it?

In a more civil tone... Nice pictures.

Mike

[TheNetwerk]

I'm not putting it up to be blasted/disrespected for sharing my experiece, so if that's on your agenda, save it.

You certainly don't mind doing the disrespecting yourself. May I suggest you save it?

In a more civil tone... Nice pictures.

Mike

I havent been disrespectful to anyone. I have never blasted anyone for sharing their opinion/experience with the show. But if someone is going to badger me over nothing, I see no reason continuing to be polite.

Thanks, not bad for a little $400 camera

[Django]

Cool pics netwerk, but do you have to have your email on there so in your face?

What is the little white racer? That's the first pic I've seen posted of that one.

The shot of the '47s kicks ass.

FWIW, he's new to the WIX, how would he know what was updated here? That is a bit unfair to rebuttle with that.

[TheNetwerk]

Cool pics netwerk, but do you have to have your email on there so in your face?

What is the little white racer? That's the first pic I've seen posted of that one.

The shot of the '47s kicks ass.

FWIW, he's new to the WIX, how would he know what was updated here? That is a bit unfair to rebuttle with that.

They dont HAVE to be there at all, but I've had problems in the past with people on forums stealing pictures (concerts) and claiming them as their own/selling them. So I've barred access to the original data (only offered lower-res small versions) and have started watermarking. I know it's not the best solution, but it's the only one I can think of without embedding code that would disallow right clicking on the whole page if my photos are present..

It's a home-built replica of this:


Here is another picture of the replica about a week before it's first flight:


It's a replica of Benny Howard's DGA-5 "Ike." I believe it was built by Kim Kovach.. I've seen the plane at Willow Run a couple times, it might live there or nearby? Canton?

And thank you, the P-47's made phototaking a dream

[mrhenniger]

I havent been disrespectful to anyone.

You certainly have been to me. Perhaps you should re-read your comments in the other thread.

In the interest of promoting peace I thank you again for your pictures. They certainly are welcome here.

Mike

[Bill Greenwood]

To Dave C, Thanks for the compliment, but in truth the thanks for having 4 Warbirds at Willow Run should go to Ed and Fran Russell for providing, and about 8 other guys who worked all week to take care of problems big and small, including rain Thursday that flooded the runway. All I did was fly a nice fighter in ideal weather over pretty country, keeping in mind the responsibilty of caring for someone else's perhaps $2 Million plane. I was lucky enough to have all those years of Spit time and it was a priviledge, I'd like to do it again but better. The hardest thing for me was just trying to recharge after 10 days on the road and at Oshkosh. More later on no shows. Bill